Using a standard switch with inline relay 500w

LightwaveRF Community: Welcome Forums Installation and Troubleshooting Using a standard switch with inline relay 500w

This topic contains 33 replies, has 6 voices, and was last updated by  michael ward 5 months, 1 week ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 34 total)
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  • #12093
     Nlotf says:

    Nlotf
    Participant

    Hello,

    First off I would like to thank the community for the valuable resources available.

    I am new to home automation in general and I searched the forum for a topic similar to mine but could not find any, my apologies if that topic existed and I did not notice it.

    I have a light fixture which only operates on On/Off no dimming, so I thought the only option available to control it is the “Inline Relay 500w”, however I want to still be able to control the fixture using a standard On/Off switch, is that even possible, and if possible would the switch control the relay (i.e. when switch is off, I would not be able to control the relay) or vice versa ?! what I eventually want is to be able to control the fixture from the link and as well from the standard switch.

    My last question is regarding fluorescent light, is the “Inline Relay 500w” the right module to control a fluorescent light ?!

    Thank you so much in advance

    Nlotf

    #12097
     skiv71 says:

    skiv71
    Participant

    Hi Nlotf,

    The inline relay will be perfect to switch a fluorescent light.

    The load contacts of the relay will behave a like the true on/off of a conventional switch, but of course, be wireless in control.

    Which brings us on to your 2nd question.

    The switch itself cannot control the relay…

    It requires a RF transmission, from either a wireless switch, wifilink command, remote control, contact switch etc etc…

    For your install, i would say…

    1/. fit a wireless switch in place of the standard switch
    2/. link the L + swL in the switch or disconnect the switchwire altogether in the light (if this is possible)
    3/. fit the relay at the light (in, or in the cavity above?).

    The relay itself requires a full feed L+N and in the case of switching this load, a loop L to the common of the relays switching contacts.
    Then connect the L to the load to the first outgoing terminal and pick a N up from the full feed (L+N).

    As always, if none of this makes sense, get an electrician in.

    Electricity is dangerous!

    HTH

    Neil

    developer of BMS Link (http://linode.bmslink.co.uk). A cloud based Home Automation platform for LightwaveRF, Z-Wave, RFXCOM.
    #12101
     Nlotf says:

    Nlotf
    Participant

    Hello Neil,

    Thank you so much for the quick reply, I truly appreciate it :) .

    I am a noob when it comes to electricity so please forgive my ignorance and of course I intend to ask an electrician to connect the wires.

    If you do not mind me asking, would the relay be damaged if an extension was added to L and N of -say- a standard switch, and then an extension from the switch itself is added to the fixture. I know there is not much sense behind what I am saying so I attached a diagram to illustrate it.

    My apologies again if the question I am asking is that dumb, the thing is I find it somehow impractical to use a wireless switch that operates on a battery and to change its battery every now and then.

    Thank you so much, Neil.

    Nlotf.

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    #12103
     skiv71 says:

    skiv71
    Participant

    Hi Nlotf,

    If you’re referring to a standard switch, they do not switch N usually, its enough to interupt the L circuit.

    If you want to use the relay as well as the switch, you could wire the switch in parallel across the C an outgoing L connection.

    You’re nearly there though

    Neil

    developer of BMS Link (http://linode.bmslink.co.uk). A cloud based Home Automation platform for LightwaveRF, Z-Wave, RFXCOM.
    #12104
     Nlotf says:

    Nlotf
    Participant

    Hello Neil,

    Thank you for the valuable information.

    If you do not mind, can you elaborate a bit on how to wire the switch in parallel with the relay ?!

    Nlotf

    #12105
     skiv71 says:

    skiv71
    Participant

    Its as per your drawing, but without the N :)

    developer of BMS Link (http://linode.bmslink.co.uk). A cloud based Home Automation platform for LightwaveRF, Z-Wave, RFXCOM.
    #12106
     Nlotf says:

    Nlotf
    Participant

    I see :) … I know I asked a lot of questions and sorry for that .

    My last question is that would I be able to turn off the light using the relay if the standard switch was ON ?! and vice versa turning off the light using the standard switch if the relay is ON ?!

    #12107
     skiv71 says:

    skiv71
    Participant

    If it were wired in parallel, it becomes an OR circuit… so either the switch gives a path OR the relay does.

    To disable the relay too… you’d need to disable the feed the relay.

    In all honesty, the 3V lithiums last a long time… i’d just use a wireless 1G :)

    Neil

    developer of BMS Link (http://linode.bmslink.co.uk). A cloud based Home Automation platform for LightwaveRF, Z-Wave, RFXCOM.
    #12121
     Nlotf says:

    Nlotf
    Participant

    Hello Neil,

    I kept thinking of a way to get the inline relay to work with a standard switch and here what I came up with, I am sharing The following diagram firstly to be corrected if I’m wrong And secondlyAs a to thank you to the community and if anyone wanted to explore this further .

    First I considered adding a standard switch, however I am better achieving what I had in mind using a standard three way switch.

    I think one can use the stop function to make sure the lights are turned off as a back up plan if he were away and not sure if the lights were on or off.

    I believe the inline relay 500w is a great relay and somehow I don’t think I can do the same using the inline dimmer as it doesn’t have the same functionality. If anyone can help with that it would be truly appreciated.

    Sincerely,
    nlotf

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    #12125
     skiv71 says:

    skiv71
    Participant

    I cannot see how that light would come on….

    You’re only feed is connected to the inline relay supply (L+N).

    The other terminals are no-volt relay contacts.

    And its not a changeover affair either.

    It’s actually 2 independent relays with the common connected (COM).

    If you send an on/open there’s a path between COM and the left o/p, send an off/stop, both relays are de-energised… send a close and the inner o/p energises.

    Neil

    developer of BMS Link (http://linode.bmslink.co.uk). A cloud based Home Automation platform for LightwaveRF, Z-Wave, RFXCOM.
    #12127
     Node Zero says:

    Node Zero
    Participant

    Because the 500w Relay is a two-position switch (not counting stop pos), yes it can be used to replace one of the 2way switches in a 2way circuit. But why would you want to? As Neil says you are looking at 12 months+ from a CR2032.
    Yes you could use the ‘stop’ function to ensure that the light is definatly off when you are not there, but if someone else is there you will have no way of knowing what position the 2way switch is in to enable you to switch it back on remotely.
    Your diagram is wrong and should be removed from here. The link is in the wrong place and it also suggests that the neutral is switched. Someone is going to get hurt.

    #12133
     Nlotf says:

    Nlotf
    Participant

    Hello Neil and Node Zero,

    Thank you so much for the quick feedback and for mentioning the drawbacks of the setup.

    As I mentioned I am no electrician and I am a noob when it comes to electricity and of course -as I mentioned earlier- a qualified electrician should get the wiring done.

    The main reason why I want to have a standard switch or in this case now a standard 3 way switch is because I want to be able to turn the light on/off in case the relay was damaged for any reason given that I live in Egypt and getting a replacement would take some time for the new relay to arrive. therefore using CR2032 would render the light fixture useless and I would have to re-wire the lights manually and get it connected to a regular switch.

    I am aware of the drawback of not knowing when the relay is on/off remotely when “stop” function is used but I was hoping someone with electrical background would be able to shed some light on the correct wire arrangement for this setup to work.

    I am -of course- willing to remove the diagram or even re draw it with the correct wiring with your help so I can benefit from this and others as well if they fancied the same setup.

    Thank you again for the quick replies.

    Sincerely,
    Nlotf

    #12135
     Node Zero says:

    Node Zero
    Participant

    I was hoping someone with electrical background would be able to shed some light on the correct wire arrangement for this setup to work.

    Its just a standard two way circuit, with one of the two way (not three way) switches removed and replaced with the 500w relay.

    #12137
     Nlotf says:

    Nlotf
    Participant

    Thank you Node Zero.

    Would you mind to further elaborate a bit regarding the correct wire arrangement and as well do you think I would be able to have the same RF/Manual control using “Inline Relay Switch Dimmer 250w” ?!

    #12139
     skiv71 says:

    skiv71
    Participant

    The inline relay will not serve as a replacement for one end of a 2 way circuit, because….

    the 2 way requires change over between state1 and state2.

    this does not exist with an inline relay as it is not a changeover.

    on powerup, neither relay o/p’s contacts will be made.

    it would be useful if the relay had a dip sw etc to imitate a changeover….

    i.e. no command, COM-innerO/P, command, COM-outerO/P.

    I might pass this onto Jim @ JSJS :)

    Neil

    developer of BMS Link (http://linode.bmslink.co.uk). A cloud based Home Automation platform for LightwaveRF, Z-Wave, RFXCOM.
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